A Great Gift a Dad Can Give His Kids

Show Transcripts:

Intro:
Welcome to the Father on Purpose Podcast, featuring author and ministry leader, Kent Evans, and business executive and military veteran, Lawson Brown. This is a show for you, dad. You want to be a godly and intentional father. Unfortunately, you’ve turned to these two knuckleheads for help. Let us know how that works out for you. Before we begin, remember this, you are not a father on accident, so go be a father on purpose. Please welcome your hosts, Kent and Lawson.

Kent Evans:
Oh, there we go. All right. I think the recording button worked this time.

Lawson Brown:
Hello Kent.

Kent Evans:
I was yelling at Hunter like, “Why are we not recording?” Lawson, how’s it going, man?

Lawson Brown:
What’s up man? I’m doing great. Happy week before Thanksgiving.

Kent Evans:
Yeah, at the time we’re recording this, Thanksgiving is upon us. I think this episode will drop right around Christmas for the first time. Now for all I know, you’re listening to this in April or July. I don’t know when you’re listening to this, but what we wanted to talk about, in today’s episode, is kind of Christmasy. So right now, here we are in mid-November and I have a six-year-old in the home, Lawson, and one of the things that we handed him about two weeks ago is we handed him, I can’t remember whether it was from Amazon or Target, but it was one of the retailers that had a Christmas catalog and they sent it in the mail and we handed him the catalog and we gave him a pen.

Kent Evans:
And even though he knows he’s not going to get everything that he might circle, it is like a, not a tradition, but it’s a little fun experience that we let them go do, and they go through the catalog and they circle a couple of things that they might like to have for Christmas. And so, the only problem you have is when the six-year-old hands it back and there’s 97 things circled, that can create a bit of a problem. But on the upside-

Lawson Brown:
That’s funny you say all that. That brought back a memory for myself. Yeah. My mom and dad did that.

Kent Evans:
Did they really?

Lawson Brown:
Yeah. As you were talking about it, I was like, “Wow, that’s a blast from the past.”

Kent Evans:
Man, given our ages, you probably circled a Daisy Red Ryder BB gun, didn’t you?

Lawson Brown:
Yeah, exactly.

Kent Evans:
A Radio Flyer Wagon.

Lawson Brown:
It was also one of the clues that clued me in on Santa Claus. I was like, “All right, so how does this work? How does it work that I picked this from a book here and Santa’s elves make this train from Sears?”

Kent Evans:
The cognitive dissonance is overwhelming as a seven-year-old. You’re thinking, “Huh? How come Santa wasn’t on the front of this catalog?” Dude [crosstalk 00:02:55].

Lawson Brown:
Anyway, your story, back to him.

Kent Evans:
Back to the story, the good news is when a six-year-old circles 97 things, the upside to that is he doesn’t remember hardly any of them, that’s the best part, is he forgets most of what he circled, because it’s just circle overwhelm, where he is just circling too much stuff. But the reason I bring that up is because often, if you and I were walking down the hall and we bumped into a guy and we said, “Hey, what are you getting your kids for Christmas?” He wouldn’t think of spiritual gifts or emotional gifts or relational gifts. He’d probably think of physical gifts. It’s Susie Talks a Lot or whatever, a little elf reference for you. And that’s what he’d probably think of, or a Buzz Saw Louie, little Veggie Tales reference for you. So what’s interesting though, as dads is, I would love to have a conversation with you, and you and I started this conversation before we began recording, about what are some of the spiritual or relational or just non-tangible gifts that we can give our kids this Christmas? And even the reason I think this would be a good episode to record is it’s not locked down to Christmas, right? It’s gifts we could give our kids throughout the year, as we go through the year. What were a couple of those gift ideas, Lawson, that came to mind as you were thinking about this episode today?

Lawson Brown:
Yeah. I actually wanted to insert something before we get into the-

Kent Evans:
No, you can’t do that, man. I’ve already started, well, I don’t know what you’re doing.

Lawson Brown:
Sure. Well…

Kent Evans:
Don’t get me off track.

Lawson Brown:
You’re not the boss of me, bro. My thought was because we’re coming into this season of holidays, Christmas in particular, where it’s centered around gift-giving. It’s a good time to have this kind of thought. Not necessarily about what physical gifts are coming anybody’s way or not, and I don’t want to lose a thought on, there are some people where the holidays are very tough. It’s a very tough time. And they may be looking for a different sort of gift altogether, that is just not going to be able to come to them right now until, I guess, if they’re going through a struggle, some sort of tragedy happened in their life and I don’t want to forget those dudes out there that this may be a super hard time to go through. But, what I was saying is, we were in a store this past weekend, and Christmas trees are up and there’s just this feeling in the air of, it’s that time of year. And so, okay this is as good a time as any, but I think we could ask ourselves this question. Often, it doesn’t just have to be, like you said, because it’s dropping, for us this episode, on Christmas time, it’s a useful introspective kind of thing to ask yourself as a dad. And so yeah, spiritual gifts, I had a conversation with one of my guys at work earlier today, in fact, just getting my thoughts together for us and said, “What comes to mind when I say something about what sorts of nonphysical gifts might you as a godly dad have in mind for Christmas?” And he immediately went to traditions-

Kent Evans:
Oh, interesting.

Lawson Brown:
…which I thought was cool. And it was not a tradition of, we start in age order and the youngest gets to open the first gift first. It was about, he said, “It’s kind of a corny thing we’ve always done. But we know that Christmas Eve is pajama time.” And he goes, “It’s not about opening a present, a box and getting up… Everybody knows it’s pajamas.” He said, “What the kids look so forward to,” especially now that he’s got a 23-year-old who’s come back, she lives out and she’s coming home for the holidays. He said, “Man, if we did not do the pajama thing, we’d have a revolt of our kids because they look so forward to everybody going and getting in their PJs and then coming back and getting hot chocolate, sitting around, talking about, just catching up.” He said, “It’s not the reception of a gift. It is the time that we have as a family that is special to that Christmas Eve experience.” And he said, “Now that I’m listening to myself talk about it,” he goes, “I think it’s about the time that we spend together, that special, carved out different than normal time and phones are put away and people are home when maybe they haven’t been home for a while.” He said, “I think number one is, it’s something to do with tradition yeah, but it’s mostly about that time, that family time.”

Kent Evans:
Man. No kidding. In fact, I do find most of the jobs I’ve had over the years, I know some guys, Christmas is a very busy season based on their job. And it’s like, “Man, it’s crunch time,” for whatever job they have. Most of the jobs I’ve had, have always been relatively speaking, slower at Christmas. I’ve had a little more time and that week between Christmas and New Year’s is relatively dead. And so, I’ve usually had a fair amount of time around Christmas to be able to, just to spend more of it at home. And I think of one of the things that I do love to try to give my boys, we’ve had five sons, as a lot of the listeners would know, and their ages 22 down to 6. And so, one of the gifts I’ve tried to give my boys over the years is as much of my time as I can possibly give them, I know it goes fast. Just this past weekend, I drove to a Pittsburgh Steelers game, so about six hours away and I took my 17-year-old son with me. And so we went to a Steelers game and there’s long story as to why, and all that. But a good friend of mine gave us some great tickets, third row, right off the field. It was amazing. We got to see a completely freezing rain tie. I mean, a tie? A tie game, nobody won and we sat in the rain for three hours. It was unbelievable. But point is, even that, even the fact that it was a tie, which is odd and unique in football, but that, the distance, the drive time… My son got yelled at by one of the Steelers fans, because he wasn’t wearing any Steelers gear, it was hilarious. And just all that stuff that you connect to the event, most of which you couldn’t have totally predicted, definitely couldn’t have predicted the outcome, but the time, just finding time to hang out with my son is for me, it’s a little bit even of a selfish gift, right? I had a blast, but I do love trying to find time with my boys. And I think about traditions. One of the traditions that my wife has insisted on for years is, which I love this idea, and I won’t take credit for it, it was her idea. We do a birthday present for Jesus tradition where we talk… We have a birthday cake, we blow out candles, we eat cake. And while we eat the cake, we talk about, what is a gift we’re going to give to Jesus in the following year? Usually, it revolves around something… Mine’s always been, not always, but often, mine has been, “I’m going to give Jesus the gift of being slow to speak” because I tend to talk before I think often, and I’ll speak out in ways that are not-

Lawson Brown:
Is Jesus still waiting on his gift?

Kent Evans:
I don’t appreciate the tone, Lawson, that you… No, but there’s a lot of truth to that where it’s like, he’s like, “Okay Kent, you’ve pretended to give me that gift now for like 18 years running.”

Lawson Brown:
Yeah, you keep re-wrapping that same gift over and over each Christmas.

Kent Evans:
Re-gifting. But even that is like, it’s silly but also really meaningful at the same time and we each get a moment to share what’s on our mind, what’s on our heart. And for me that’s become a really, really fun tradition. I wouldn’t even have said it was a tradition until now here we are in year, I don’t know, 20 or 22 or however long we’ve been doing it. And it’s become a really fun part of our Christmas.

Lawson Brown:
It’s a cool idea. Yeah. I don’t want to harp on the time thing, but like you, my jobs have, until now actually, my jobs have been like yours. Everybody can hardly wait until the holiday season because our customers, to them, it’s a time where they pull away or it’s, at one point I was in the multifamily business and people don’t move, which is a big, when people move in an apartment building, it’s busy. They got to redo it, they got to, somebody’s going out, somebody’s coming in and not a lot of people move between Thanksgiving and new year. So for us, that customer base was quiet. Now, different scenario and we’re going to be closing the month. And so it’s not a super quiet time. But for many of us, it can be that long weekend or it could be the time where you finally squeeze in that last bit of vacation. And depending on when the days hit, you may have an actual Friday afternoon until the following Monday morning off. And I think the treasure of like, we act different, we as dads act different when we’re home and we have some time on our hands and we’re not stressing about having to get up early the next morning as always or getting the presentation done or getting to the branch and making sure that everything is done on time and complete and everything’s been shipped. For some people that is the case. I feel for them because I hope they find another way to do it, but yeah, for a lot of people man, I think as long as I hope your kids, it’s okay that they feel a difference in us around this time of year. Yeah.

Kent Evans:
Yeah, and so let me do this, man. I’m going to list a handful and I love what you pointed out a little while ago about for some dads. This might be the time of year that’s really tough for whatever reason. I have a friend who had a loved one, I’m speaking of a very specific friend who had a loved one pass away this year. And I know this will be the year of first, right?

Lawson Brown:
Right.

Kent Evans:
This will be the first Thanksgiving, the first Christmas without this loved one and I know that’s going to be very, very difficult for them as a family. And so for some guys this may not be just all joy and fun at Christmas. And for some guys, maybe they don’t have cash. They don’t have a lot of money. Maybe it’s tight right now and trying to make ends meet. In that light, I want to rattle off. Okay, I’m going to just speed round. I’m going to rattle off a handful of ideas and I want you to react Lawson to a couple of these ideas. Here are some gifts that are basically cash-wise, they’re free. They don’t cost anything money-wise that you could consider giving to your kids and your wife incidentally this year for Christmas. One of those could be knowing or reading the Bible. And you may go, “Well, that seems like an odd gift.” Well, man, a lot of scripture would talk about how different we are when we know God’s word when we’re in God’s word. And so, giving your family the gift of spending time in God’s word is giving them a more mature man, a more mature dad, a dad who’s better, more patient, can listen well. Even that, listening. Listening just specifically listening could be a great gift that you might need to give one of your kids this year. You may need to ask them. I remember this past summer, one of my boys said, “Dad, I know what you’re trying to do is you’re trying to be helpful. But what you’re doing is actually making things worse.” And I’m like, “Awesome. Awesome. Tell me why that is.” Right? So I got to listen to him explain to me what it was that I was doing that I thought might be helpful, but clearly was not being very helpful. So the gift of listening, the gift of reading the Bible, the gift of a piece in your heart, the gift of forgiveness, and I’m not even sure you need to forgive someone in your home as much as you might need to forgive someone outside your home. And then you become less bitter and less angry and less frustrated. So maybe you don’t need to forgive one of your children, but you need to forgive that guy at work who stole that job from you or lied about you or that relative who you’ve been holding that resentment against for a long time. Maybe you need to give your kids a sense of unity, maybe to give them just a sense that they belong in your family. Maybe you need to write them a letter. Maybe one of your kids is out of the house and you may not see them this as much this holiday season as you’d like. And so, one of the things you could give them would be just a heartfelt letter. Doesn’t have to belong, doesn’t have to be poetic. It could just be a letter where you write and say, “Hey, I just wanted you to know a couple of things I admire about you or a couple of things that I’ve never forgotten you did as a child.” Is there a gift of a letter that you could give to one of your kids?

Lawson Brown:
That’s a big one for when our kids, before they had jobs and had money, what do I want from my kids? I’d love a Christmas card where actually handwrite some stuff in. And oh my gosh, what a great thing that was to get from my daughters was a letter like that. That’s a part of the tradition. I talked to like I said, I talked to Joe earlier today, listening to you rattle through that list-

Kent Evans:
Man, that was-

Lawson Brown:
I’m going to sit down and write out all this for myself because that’s really cool. That’s inspiring. And it’s things that I had, I wouldn’t have thought of, had I not gone through this exercise with you. Something Joe said was, he feels like it’s a helpful season to help reset their family foundation around some of the things that you’ve gone through. And he specifically, this is God at work because he said it and then you just said it. He said it’s a peaceful time or can be a peaceful time and helps them as a family get re-grounded a sense of unity among themselves and the physical time spent together helps. But man, to put some constructive thought into it, I encourage, I’m doing it myself. I also would encourage the dads listening, take some time and maybe put pen to paper or pull out your notes app on your iPhone and put down some things that whether you give them and you proclaim, this is a gift to you all, to your family, that you do them so that it results in a gift. I think that’s a really cool thought. And listening to you rattle through those man, that was, that’s a lot. That’s a much better gift than-

Kent Evans:
Well, and to your point, some of them we give and we’re not going to announce them. It’s like, there’s a trumpet and I would go present the gift. It’s not so much that has to be like that. But for example, one simple one, right? Read your kids a story. You may go, “Oh, I do that every night.” Awesome. Read them two stories. Let them pick the book, whatever. But we find a way to read our kids’ story and we don’t make a big deal about it. But man, later they’re going to be 20, 25, 30 and go, “Oh yeah, I remember my dad reading stories to me, especially around the holidays.” Or whatever. Another one that we’ve started to do a little more as our kids have gotten a bit older and I’m in a home where we’ve raised five boys. And the reason I mentioned that is because sometimes it was hard to find dedicated time to give to any one of the boys, right. It’s almost always, you got or three in tow and they’re all doing something and it’s, we’re all going to the mall or we’re all going on that errand or we’re all going on that vacation or whatever. And it’s like, individual time if you have the time and the calendar. And if you got-

Lawson Brown:
You mean one on one time?

Kent Evans:
Exactly. And what would be, what would really make that even more special is if you could ask your child, “Hey man, if we could go spend an hour or two doing something that just you would love to do, what would that be?” And let your child pick the activity. It might be something as simple as drawing a picture on a sheet of paper. They may be artistic and that’s fun to them or throwing football out in the front yard. One of my sons really loves to go to a gun range and shoot. He really loves that. And when he’s home from college, this December, I know one way that he would really enjoy. One thing he’d really enjoy is if I could go spend an hour or two, just shooting some guns with him at a shooting range, he would love that. And it’s not super expensive and he would have a blast. Now I wouldn’t probably choose to do that. That’s not my idea of a fun Saturday afternoon, but I don’t mind it. I enjoy it enough. And I know he loves it. And so I’ll go because I know it’s something that he enjoys. So is there something that your kids enjoy that you could go do in that regard? Maybe it doesn’t cost anything at all, but you just know, even just letting them pick would be a big deal.

Kent Evans:
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Lawson Brown:
What do you think about your kids being involved with you to do something for your wife?

Kent Evans:
Well, I mean, first off, I don’t really ever do anything for my wife.

Lawson Brown:
Poor April. April, I’m with you.

Kent Evans:
Yeah. I never-

Lawson Brown:
If you’re out there listening I’m with you.

Kent Evans:
…serve her. I don’t. No, actually it’s a great question. I remember last year I took one of my boys to a particular store that I knew she would love stuff from, right. It’s like a handmade store in our city. And most of the stuff in this store is from somewhere other than America. So it’s like this wood thing from Ethiopia or this beaded necklace from South America or whatever. And they’re not super expensive, but they’re all handmade. And I knew she’d love that. And I remember one day I was going somewhere and I had one of my boys with me and I was like, oh, let’s go to this one gallery and see if we can find anything for your mom. And the cool part was he was in on the play, right? So he’s walking around the store, holding stuff up going, “Hey dad, Hey dad, would she like this?”

Lawson Brown:
Yeah.

Kent Evans:
And it was fun. It was like a mini-adventure. And we had a blast and I got her a couple things that even today she still loves a little tea mug that’s cool and painted. Man, nothing quite like the double whammy of taking my kids on an errand where the goal of the errand is to bless my wife because not only am I blessing my wife, having fun, creating fun memories with my boys, I’m giving them a little bit of a hint as to how to be a godly husband one day, right? They’re picking this stuff up by osmosis. So yeah, great question. I don’t, I’m not super like intentional. I don’t have like mommy shopping day and it’s like all focused and scheduled. Maybe some guys are a little more intentional than me in that regard, but certainly for sure I take my boys along when I think of it.

Lawson Brown:
Yeah. And it doesn’t have to be necessarily, we’re talking gifts and shopping and Christmas and to a degree but during the time, grab one of your kids and get them down in the kitchen and let’s sneak down there and make mommy breakfast and surprise her with coffee and breakfast and get them involved in doing something versus making I mean, if you, they’re making a piece of artwork or something like that, that’s different. But not going and buying a gift is, I guess what I’m saying. But I want to do something for each of them that involves the rest of the people in the family where we’re, maybe it is a letter, maybe where we’re going to do something for them that they wouldn’t expect because we’re all going to be at home. It probably depends on the love language, but doing something for somebody to a lot of people that really, it really hits home. And it means so much more than an actual physical gift can. Depends on the person.

Kent Evans:
Well, and I think one of the common threads across a lot of these gift ideas that we’re talking about is time. And I know we mentioned earlier, maybe we don’t quite harp on that, but I do think it’s very important that I was with a ministry leader last week and brilliant guy. And one of the things he said to me was he said, “We can’t underestimate how important the gift of our time is. Especially when it is undivided, focused attention time. So if I were to, I’ll go back to the example. If I were to take my son out to the range and we would do a little shooting and the whole time I’m there, I’m like texting people and I’m distracted, I’m not paying attention. It doesn’t quite count. It doesn’t quite count or it doesn’t send the message that I want to send. And so, I guess I would use other words, right? So a gift of time can also be a gift of attention. It can be a gift of focus. It can be a gift of listening. It can be a gift of asking, not probing, like gotcha-type questions, but asking thoughtful questions that just go, “Hey, man, I’d really love to know what was a big challenge?” I have a son coming home from college this December and he’ll be home for the first, not for the first time since college, but I mean, this will be his first big break after his first semester in college. And if I’m smart, right? If I’m on my game and I’m thinking, I’ll ask him questions about, and we’ve talked a lot. FaceTime and texting has made going away to college much more of a communal experience because he’ll sit there with his artboard and show me what he’s working on. So we’ve stayed in very close contact.

Lawson Brown:
That’s awesome.

Kent Evans:
But I’d love to ask him over the holidays, what were a couple things you learned about yourself over the last few months? What were couple things you learned about living life or managing your own time or what was one thing that surprised you about the college experience? I’d love to be pulling that stuff out just by way of hearing his heart and learning more about what’s on his mind. And I think for men we always think of gifts in the context of tangible and physical and money and all that. Man, our time, our attention, our focus, and I would guess lost and this is a little bit of just a random guess. Since you’ve raised two daughters, I would guess that you probably had a lot of those moments in their teen years where just you spending focused time and attention with them probably really meant a lot to them.

Lawson Brown:
Yeah. It meant a lot to me too. I think you’re right. I guess time came up because it can be some vacation time or long weekend, but it’s the attention that matters. What you just said really inspired me. If I knew that I was having a special guest, some business guy or some ministry guy that was going to come to your home and spend some time with you, you would put together some questions. You would get your thoughts together. And right now I’m with my girls a good bit because they both live with us. They’re in a period of their life where they used to live together in an apartment in Atlanta. Now we’re all back together. That’s not going to last for who knows how much longer, but for now we’re together for a few months and we have been for a little bit. But that quality, that quality attention and putting some thoughtful effort into, like you said, what is it that I wanted to ask Abigail or Olivia and carve out some specific pointed time where they’re like a special guest to me. Because there will be a time when I’m going to really miss them and they’re not going to be able to come home for the holidays and they’re going to have their own family thing going on. So I’m going to treat it as if not to go out and buy a special gift, but I’m going to reframe my mental perspective and get ready for these special guests that we’re about to have.

Kent Evans:
Wow. That’s a great way to put it. Well, I’ve often observed around our house, we tend to give our families the worst version of ourselves or at least I didn’t say the worst version. They see the worst part of us. Maybe it’s not the worst version totally but-

Lawson Brown:
But they see all parts. They see everything, yeah.

Kent Evans:
All parts. That’s a better way to say it. They see all parts. And so there are a lot of moments around our home where my kids are like, “[Jesus 00:00:30:19], dad, you stop yelling at us. This is crazy.” And I would probably never yell at you that way. You know what I’m saying? I have a filter. I have a filter for what I would say to Lawson. And I probably never yell at you that, but man, I yelled them. And so part of the gift we could give our families this season, and again, if you’re listening to this in April and you’re listening to this in October, do it now. Give your family the gift.

Lawson Brown:
It’s never too late.

Kent Evans:
Right. Give your family the gift of treating them like a special guest and giving them the same honor that you give to a guest who just showed up. Because what we know for sure, right? We know this as dads like innately, we know it, we don’t always say it out loud. The gifts we can give our family the most, most, most important gifts are gifts of time, gifts of the heart, gifts of a listening ear. We know deep down as dads, those things matter even more, even more the gift of fun, the gift of fun. We’ll play more games during Christmas. I always like to build a puzzle. Most of my boys, one of my sons enjoys puzzle building. The other four don’t really and Titus is only six. He pretty much just eats the pieces. And so you really don’t want to build a puzzle with Titus, unless you like a 95% type puzzle, where you go, “Hey, what happened to 10 of these pieces?” And Titus is going because he’s the one who actually ate one of the pieces. But I’ve got a daughter-in-law now who enjoys puzzle building. Hallelujah, man. My son picked really well. I got a puzzle-building daughter-in-law. And so, just the other day, my wife and I were talking about, do we have a puzzle around here that she would enjoy building that I could go get?

Lawson Brown:
That’s fun. That’s fun.

Kent Evans:
So when she comes, we build it. And the only problem with that is she’s a stud puzzle builder. So you got to drink coffee and do a bunch of jumping jacks to get ready to be able to keep up with her because she is fast. If you just sat down and built a thousand-piece puzzle, she’d put down 942 pieces while you’re still like turning the corner, trying to [crosstalk 00:32:25]

Lawson Brown:
You were like, “I was about to get that piece. I was about to do that too.”

Kent Evans:
And those other 47 pieces I had them, right. I was that close. So for sure, I just want to encourage dads, man. As you think about any time of the year, but if you’re listening to this around Christmas, ask yourself what gift can I give to my family this Christmas, each individually, it could be all those things we talked about. Go back and listen to the fast-paced list we gave early. It could be any series of gifts, time-based, listening, you name it. Dad leans into your fan and give them some gifts this Christmas and I pray that you’ll have an awesome and very Merry Christmas if you’re listening to this around the holidays. If you’re listening to this in April, where you been, man? What took you so long and why are you just now listening to the Christmas edition? Next year won’t you give us a gift? Give me a loss in a gift of being on time for the episodes. Thank you guys for listening.

Lawson Brown:
Yeah, Merry Christmas.

Kent Evans:
Have a Merry Christmas and we’ll see you next week.

Speaker 1:
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Voiceover:
You’ve been dozing off to the Father on Purpose Podcast, featuring Kent Evans and Lawson Brown. Now wake up, head over to fatheronpurpose.org for more tools that can help you be a godly, intentional and now a completely horrible dad. Remember you are not a father on accident. So go be a father on purpose.